Air Conditioning, Part 2

[Last TR]

I contacted Vintage Air a few months ago about fitting modern AC to the TR8. They list a couple of "universal" kits for about $1200 or $1300. I thought it might be something I could install. Last week I went to talk to a Vintage Air installer in Portland, and found it's not at all simple. Their advice for ease of installation was to get a rebuildable stock TR7/8 AC unit with controls for under the dash, and use the modern pieces in the engine compartment along with additional cooling equipment for the engine. Ballpark cost? About $3500 to $4000 installed. Not sure where I'm going next with this.

Ken Morton
Anchorage, Alaska

1980 TR8, 1973 TR6, 1965 Volvo PV544, 1958 MGA, Jeep Cherokees

[UKPhilTR7]

That is a shame to hear as I was thinking of installing a universal kit myself and replacing the old tr heater matrix. I was going to look at the one on car builder solutions.

[Hasbeen]

That is exactly what I did, & about what it cost.

Hasbeen

[Workshop Help]

Have you boys considered rolling down the windows on those few, infrequent summer days when motoring about in the glory of the Sun? Don't forget, the floor vents can usher a veritable hurricane of refreshing crispness onto ones lower limbs. Finally, there's 'mind over matter', if you don't mind, it don't matter.

Mildred Hargis

[Hasbeen]

Don't you live in Texas Mildred? I thought Texas got hot.

Around here in summer you close those foot well vents, because the air from them is coming up off the black bitumen road is so hot it will pickle you.

It may be all right for you young girls, but us old blokes aint as tough as we once were.

Hasbeen

[FI Spyder]

Don't forget Mildred, our temperate days are Ken's (Don't forget he's from Alaska) raging heat waves. It's going to cost a lot of money if they do it themselves. Will they work with you? I got an estimate for my Integra (which had freon coming out the interior vents when it packed it in last summer) $1,000 for just taking out the dash plus all the rest.

Rather than dump it on their laps, I would put in the new/old A/C TR7 heater, hook up the new coolant hoses, install the brackets, compressor, hoses, dryer, fans and shroud and condenser myself. It would take time but you would save a lot of money. They would then just have to charge it and check for leaks. Not easy. On second thought I would just keep the top up, unzip the back window, roll the windows done and keep a water bottle handy in a cooler. But then I like the warmer weather any ways.[8D]

I did drive my TR7 in 90f+ when I drove it home from Sacramento that lasted pretty much until I got to Blaine WA. where it was raining and in the 60's. OK it's a dryer heat, probably not like the high heat, high humidity Hasbeen might have or those Floridians. I know some can take it some can't. I had a brother-in-law that when I thought it was just getting comfy warm, he sweating like a stuck pig (Canadian expresion?) and had to have the A/C on full blast.



- - -TR7 Spider - - - 1978 Spitfire- - - - 1976 Spitfire - - 1988 Tercel 4X4 - Kali on Integra - 1991 Integra - Yellow TCT

[DutchTriumph]

<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Century Gothic, Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by Last TR</i>

Their advice for ease of installation was to get a rebuildable stock TR7/8 AC unit with controls for under the dash, and use the modern pieces in the engine compartment
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></font id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

Exactly what I'm trying to do. I took the parts prom this TR7 http://www.forum.triumphtr7.com/topic.a ... C_ID=20372









And all the small parts and hoses. The hoses will have to be replaced because of age and the modern gas. I can use the pipes on the end of the hoses, to make the new ones.

I think I'm going to use a modern pump, don't know the condition from this one. But more important, this one needs about 12bhp to run and a modern pump 3bhp.

<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Century Gothic, Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by Mildred</i>

Don't forget, the floor vents
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></font id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

Unfortunately, we don't have them over here, neither did the American spec DHC at the scrapyard

Cheers,
Peter

1977 TR7 FHC, 1976 Spitfire 1500

[Workshop Help]

In the library is a book entitled,'Power and Economy Handbook' from 1956. One of the better tips for enhanced power, economy, and all round making your car better is this paragraph.

CAR AIR CONDITIONING

Here is the answer to the few hot-hot days that pop up every summer in every corner of the land. No need to install a $500.00 air conditioner for just the few days each year you'd ever use it. Just use this little trick: close all the windows, then simply set a low pail filled with ice on the floor under the dashboard of your car. Fresh air coming in through the hood vent will pass over the pail of ice, cooling your car comfortably. A low pan (instead of a pail) with a large block of ice (the 25c size that you can get at any ice station) works best. Costly air conditioning systems are not indispensible...you can keep cool this way for mere pennies on those hottest days each year.

So there you have it, wisdom from the past. Freon! Such a piffle!

Mildred Hargis

[DutchTriumph]

Ice could work, I think it's not that practical.
The thing is, we don't have "ice stations" on every corner. I can't even remember when I've seen one over here.


Cheers,
Peter

1977 TR7 FHC, 1976 Spitfire 1500

[Last TR]

Though I grew up without air conditioning, I do find even moderate heat hard to take since moving north half my life ago. I was really hoping there was an affordable way to air condition the TR8. I haven't found the top-up-vent-open method to be very effective for my lack of heat tolerance.

The Vintage Air installer gave me 2 options:

The first one I outlined above would use the original TR heater and evaporator under the dash with a modern compressor and condenser under the bonnet. This would have a factory look in the cockpit, but be more efficient.

The other method would replace the entire under-dash TR unit with a modern heater/AC unit as well as using all the modern stuff under the hood. Controls in the cockpit would not look original, if that matters, and most of the glove box would be replaced by the new AC unit.

The cost would be about the same either way according to the Portland shop, $3500 to $4000.

Ken Morton
Anchorage, Alaska

1980 TR8, 1973 TR6, 1965 Volvo PV544, 1958 MGA, Jeep Cherokees

[DutchTriumph]

The radiator from the cooling system and the condenser from the air-con are against each other. Air has to pass both of them, so why do both systems have their own fan(s)?
Can't we just use the fan's from the air-con to cool the engine, just like they do in a modern car?

Cheers,
Peter

1977 TR7 FHC, 1976 Spitfire 1500

[FI Spyder]

I think it's a matter of efficiency (which wasn't as good back in the day). Plus, because the condenser is against the radiator the cooling won't be quite as good so the condenser fans are also used to cool the radiator when the switch in the radiator reaches a certain temp even if the A/C is not being used.

- - -TR7 Spider - - - 1978 Spitfire- - - - 1976 Spitfire - - 1988 Tercel 4X4 - Kali on Integra - 1991 Integra - Yellow TCT

[Hasbeen]

One of our main problems, most will not suffer is the heat from the dash. With our sun almost directly overhead, beating down through the large windscreen, the dash gets too hot to touch. The heat radiated from this into your face makes daytime summer driving in a 7 unpleasant. I don't own my cars to suffer unpleasant driving.

I have a bit of heart & lung damage from my third heart attack. Just walking 75 yards out to the front gate & back must be managed slowly, or I'm puffing like a steam train. I feel like I can not breath, or get enough air into my lungs if it is hot.

There is no way I can even ride in a car with the heater on unless, like my old GM Holdens it gives hot air in the footwell, & cold air in your face. The S2000, with the hood down gives a similar effect.

For any using part of the old system, we machined the front of the standard 7 compressor mount down about 18mm, which brought a modern compressor into line with the crank & fan pulley.

Apart from that, & the under dash unit from the US, everything is new. Total cost $3500, & worth every penny. I am now back to the 6/7000 kilometers a year in the thing, rather than the 2400 in the 16 months after my last heart attack.

Do remember, you can't take it with you. It is not actually even your money you are spending, it's your kids inheritance, so sod the little buggers, [}:)] be comfortable before you go. [:D]

Hasbeen

Wow! Mistakes everywhere. Do you think I must be getting old. Even I would not spend $35,000 on an air conditioning system.

[DutchTriumph]

Pleasant driving is exactly why I want to fit an air-con. I'll be using original parts, because they are made to fit the car.
Hoses and dryer will be replaced, and I want to fit a modern pump.

I've no idea how good the standard fans are, but two fans behind each other isn't that efficient.

Something like this looks more up to the job, and two 10inch models will fit.



But will these be efficient enough to cool the engine?







Cheers,
Peter

1977 TR7 FHC, 1976 Spitfire 1500

[HDRider]

If you look at the wiring diagram you will see that there is a cold switch which turns off the aux fans when the evaporator is cool enough.

I notice this if I have been on the freeway and then pull off into traffic, After a couple of minutes I hear the fans come back on.

I just did the Sanden conversion on the 76 FHC. It is working quite well. I had to turn it down today after about 5 miles as it was getting too cold even though the outside temp was about 85.

Edward Hamer
Petaluma CA