Red Ignition Light on and stays on

[tya2agt]

Dear Group,

I recently rescued a nice CANADIAN VERSION 1980 TR7 convertible from the fate of a "cash for clunkers" program. About 100,000 km on it. Buddy told me it was going to die Saturday afternoon, too many lookers and no buyers because they had no plates and they could not get it to run (CHOKE) (something their local hockey team does in the playoff finals, ours does not have that problem, because they finish last every year). Issues were pollution testing in order to get insurance, so no pollution test, no insurance, no test drives. I came up with the cash and he bought it.

The original owner died, after being in a nursing home. The TR7 had not run on road in 8 years, grandson did not want it, and had someone sell it for him. No service records. Got it towed to buddy's place.

This car is 1200 Kilometres away from me in Vancouver BC, and I am in Edmonton Alberta over the mountains away. Alberta is the environmental pariah of North America because of Tar Sands and has no environmental testing. I got insurance for it Monday and sent a plate and papers to my buddy. Tuesday after a dose of fresh high test gas the TR7 runs and drives, stops and does not appear to overheat (knock on wood) on a 20 KM local drive. Many of the electrical circuits even WORK. Red ignition light is on and stays on. What does this light mean?

IS THE IGNITION LIGHT A BRITISH WAY OF SAYING YOUR ALTERNATOR OUTPUT IS LOW OR OFF LINE? Is this car in danger of suddenly dying because of low battery output?

I am trying to decide whether to put the car on a train and have it
delivered to Alberta ($530) or whether to take a bus or plane and pick up the TR7 and bring it back. The old guy selling the car for the grandson tried to convince me TRs were not designed to do a 1200 km trip. I have been an airplane owner and operator for 38 years and spent about 18 years working on one with a dodgy electrical system.

My trouble shooting from afar suggests cleaning the battery connections and retightening them, and ditto for the alternator output. Any other simple suggestions?

2nd question anyone in favor of me taking the roadtrip? or should the triumph go for a train ride?

Thanks Reg
yellow Canadian spec 1980 TR7 Convertible 202617

80 TR-7 Convertible

[FI Spyder]

Welcome to the forum.

After being stored for 7 years and winning Spider on eBay (2006), I took a bus to Sacramento, took the LRT out to Folsom and drove back the Spider to Duncan, B.C. (including over the Shasta mountain range), a 900 mile journey (on dodgy, little tread tires) with no problems other than 55 mph shimmy caused by the tires.

After going over the car, in 2011, I did a club run down to San Diego with no problems (the only car with that claim). That trip was over 3,000 miles.

That being said, with your red alt. light you would have to make sure the alternator is putting out or the trip won't last long. I would measure battery voltage with car off (should be 12-13+ volts). Start the car and measure voltage across the battery, it should be a volt or so higher (13-14.5 volts).

There is a plastic block by the battery that the major battery/alt. wires go into. These should be cleaned. Take some contact cleaner or metal polish with you for any connections that are corroded. Along with small brush and pipe cleaners might come in handy.

I've made that trip many times. Both taking the Jasper route and the Calgary route (a more populated route with more towns along the way) a better route I would say in case any problems pop up.

The biggest problem you will have with a long stored car is dirty electrical connections as they are "exposed". Your hoses and v belt will be old (not to mention tires).

There's something to be said about throwing caution to the wind and taking on an adventure. That's what life is about. Did that more than once. Make sure there is sufficient coolant to prevent overheating as that will warp the head rendering it useless. That was the only thing that was an unknown on my trip as the temp sender was not working.

You can download the OEM manual in pdf from jclay's website (do a search on forum) that has all the wiring diagrams. I'd have that with me plus some tools, engine is SAE, rest is metric.

- - -TR7 Spider - - - 1978 Spitfire- - - - 1976 Spitfire - - 1988 Tercel 4X4 - Kali on Integra - 1991 Integra - Yellow TCT

[tya2agt]

Dear Sypder

Since you are alive and well, is my interpretation from afar with no manual for reference correct that red ignition light on means no alternator output?

Second question, there is the possibility of putting the TR7 on a front wheel car dolly and towing it back that way? Any idea if a long tow at highway speeds with rear wheels on the ground is harmful to a standard transmission TR7?

Glad to hear there are others out there with a sense of adventure! However the towns along I-5 are a lot closer together than those on the Yellowhead highway.

So tow on a dolly, or on a flatbead? or take the train?

Reg

80 TR-7 Convertible

[FI Spyder]

Don't tow the car as is as it has an internal transmission oil pump and you'll destroy the transmission (limited to 30 miles and under 30 mph). If you want to tow, take off the drive shaft, not that big a job. Long way to tow a car I would go flatbed if I was doing it myself.

$500+ is pretty cheap to get it transported by train (other than bother of getting it to it). I was quoted $1,700 from Sacramento which included border crossing, HST, ferry crossing etc. After all is said and done may be you best bet (if throwing caution to the wind isn't an option)[:p].

The red light may be no alt. output or some other not critical wiring problem.



- - -TR7 Spider - - - 1978 Spitfire- - - - 1976 Spitfire - - 1988 Tercel 4X4 - Kali on Integra - 1991 Integra - Yellow TCT

[TR Tony]

The car has it's own voltage gauge, top right of the instrument pod. It will give you a good indication of whether or not the alternator is charging, it should be at around the 3/4 mark with the car running at idle without lights on.

To be more accurate you can of course use a meter on the battery connections but the built in gauge should give you a good idea.

And well done on saving the car from the crusher!

Tony

<font size="1">1981 TR7 FHC Cavalry Blue
1980 TR7V8 DHC Jaguar Regency Red - sadly sold!
1977 TR8 FHC EFI Factory development car Inca Yellow</font id="size1">

[jclay (RIP 2018)]

[url="https://docs.google.com/folder/d/0B8MWEvqOpX3udEF4SmFQUW9RS09hbU5uNW5Wd0xrUQ/edit?pli=1#docId=1Pa2Ii1jjXRu6PRnYw8jzKQqOU8UR7PFpKoceF1JEI0o"]Alternator Swap[/url]

Clay

[url="http://www.jclay.me/"]My Triumph Site[/url], [url="http://www.triumphtechnical.me"]Technical Stuff[/url], [url="https://docs.google.com/folder/d/0B8MWEvqOpX3udEF4SmFQUW9RS09hbU5uNW5Wd0xrUQ/edit"]My Public Folder[/url],

[Hasbeen]

Hi Reg, & welcome to the fun.

I think Spyder must have had a pact with the devil, to have got away with his trip.

I got a 7 back on the road 12 years ago, after it had sat for some time. I replaced all but one coolant hose, the long one under the carbs, & the rear brake hose. Both were in a box of parts, but I thought I had done them, before my first celebratory weekend away in the car.

After about 300 miles, the coolant hose blew with a large bang. Fortunately a friendly tractor dealer managed to replicate it with 2 hoses & a length of copper pipe.

I was lucky the failing brake hose only started reducing the return flow from the rear brakes, causing them to drag, & become quite hot, a couple of weeks after my return from that trip. No real problem a few miles from home, with the hose all ready there to fit, but on a distant mountain, it may have been.

These cars are simple, not too hard to restore, in your garage. On the side of a mountain road, perhaps somewhat harder. Your car, & many of it's components are now 12 years older than mine were then.

I'd take the train.

Hasbeen

[silverseven]

I'd through caution to the wind and train the thing back home.

If it was a running, plated car with no known problems , I'd call it a road trip....on a probably poorly stored car that ha sat idle for 8 yearsand has a known electric gremlin the trip will be a nightmare.

Besides 530$ for a train ride is dirt cheap , it would cost you more to rent a trailer and fuel the truck !!!!

Ron.

[Sautie]

Never never tow a 7,8 or Rover SD1, the manuals don't tell you but you will definately do untold damage to the gearbox all because of another piece of stupid English engineering. However to you ignition light & this is a long shot. Long ago I had a very hot TR3 which had (in 1967) an alternator. No problems until one day the red ignition light stayed on despite the ammeter (voltmeter) showed that the battery was being charged. I visited the Lucas competition department in Birmingham (UK) & they immediately new what the problem was, a blown diode in the TR4 ( a Lucas part not the car) alternator control box mounted on the firewall. Now this was an early model Alternator & soon after this control box was incorporated into the Alternator. This is that area that you can damage when jump starting. I would suggest that you have the alternator checked over.

[bmcecosse]

The alternator problem may simply be broken (or very loose) fan belt - has that been checked ? Or, it's more likely to be sticking brushes - sometimes can be cleared with a good 'tap' from something heavy, or a quick strip down to free them off properly. Also make sure the battery is connected right way round..... -ve earth. In Canada - if you have breakdown/recovery insurance - will they bring the car (and you) home if the car fails along the way?

[tya2agt]

Dear TR7 Group

Well I showed up with a new alternator and picked up the yellow TR7. I have a shop install the alternator and they struggled with the case before realizing it needed to be rotated 60 degrees to fit. Got it installed, everything works fine. We did a tour of shops and airports around Vancouver BC running errands and checking out the general serviceability of the car. Then oops the alternator light is on again, we check under the hood and the belt is hanging loose. Back to the shop that installed it. Point out that the alternator is not aligned with the other pulleys in the system. They muck around for a while and install it again. 600 Km down the road in the middle of the mountains in the dark thee is a banshee wailing death squeal, no belts missing, stuff is turning, keep going to the next down 50 miles away. Stop at a motel and restaurant for supper and realize yes it is the alternator belt causing the problem because the IGN light is slow to go out on start up!@ Will fix it in the morning somehow.

Reg

80 TR-7 Convertible

[Beans]

Most (if not all) aftermarket alternators for the TR7 need alignment of it's pulley with the other two pulleys.
This shouldn't be much of a problem for the average workshop ...
When you buy the alternator from a reputed TR7 specialist that should be OK.

<center>
<font color="blue"><i>1980 TR7 DHC (my first car, now restored and back on the road)
1981 TR7 FHC Sprint (better known as 't Kreng)</font id="blue">
<b>[url="http://www.tr7beans.blogspot.com/"]<u><b><font size="3"><font color="red">My full Weblog</font id="red"></font id="size3"></b></u>[/url]</b></i></center>

[Hasbeen]

Some time back the near new alternator/fan belt just disappeared off the TR8.

Have you ever noticed how hard it is to see something is not there? The thing started to get a bit hot. My son who had the car stopped, looked, but could see nothing wrong. He was near home, & called me. It took a few minutes before we realised what we could not see was the fan belt.

It took some mucking around to get a replacement, as the front is not stock, & we didn't have noted what belt was required.

It did it again in less than 1000Km. That is when we found we had bent one side of the crank pulley in a little, in one spot, while doing something under there, narrowing the width, & straining the belt each time it went through that spot.

Are your pulleys undamaged?

Hasbeen

[FI Spyder]

So you decided to drive it home. Who said Canadians aren't adventuresome.[:p]

The belt may have some initial stretch and may need to be tightened up a bit.

In the first year when I had my car on the road the alternator started screeching periodically (I had taken it apart to clean it up, replaced brushes, clean commutator). The bearings were bad. I got them replaced at a local alternator shop. It soon started to squeal again. I phoned the shop and they assured me they only use quality Japanese bearings. I loosened the fan belt (to check bearings) and retightened it. The screech went away and never came back. The point is belt tension is critical (at least on mine). You don't want it too tight (shorten bearing life) or too loose (squeal/slipping belt/loss of charge rate).



- - -TR7 Spider - - - 1978 Spitfire- - - - 1976 Spitfire - - 1988 Tercel 4X4 - Kali on Integra - 1991 Integra - Yellow TCT

[troydeon]

Props to you for making the decision to drive it... I have a feeling that as others have said, that it just might be a bit loose now... looking forward to you r update...

Troy
1980 TR7 DHC