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POWER STEERING

The all purpose forum for any TR7/8 related topics.
j.johnson23
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POWER STEERING

Postby j.johnson23 » 25 Feb 2019 09:59

I have finally got to the point in life where I accept the steering on my TR7V8 is too heavy at slow speeds (yes I am old).
The electric conversions look like the most sensible idea these days but my concern is their reliability, has anyone been using this type of conversion for a while and can attest to the reliability.
I take it a speed sensitive option would be available as The steering is fine once I am on the move.

Cobber
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Re: POWER STEERING

Postby Cobber » 25 Feb 2019 13:12

The OEM elecy power steering on my MGF has given no trouble at all, so impressed am I that I have a spare MGF unit to adapt to my TR7.
I have a variable control unit from a company here in OZ called Jaycar, so I'll be able to adjust how much assistence and at what speeds to apply it at.
I should be able to avoid over assisting the steering, which is the problem with most power steering systems IMHO.
They only need to deploy at parking speeds, OEM units are sometimes used to hide torque steer in front wheel drive cars, it's lazy engineering.
Most OEM systems seem to be tuned to suit: FWD, weak sheilas, puny office johnies and/or fat lazy bastards! :lol:
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Beans
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Re: POWER STEERING

Postby Beans » 25 Feb 2019 18:02

I am currently looking at this option, as it comes with a "quick" rack;
https://www.classicdrivingdevelopment.co.uk/cats.asp?cID=6&carID=6&page=TR7%2F8+POWER+ASSISTED+STEERING
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Roger27TBB
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Re: POWER STEERING

Postby Roger27TBB » 25 Feb 2019 19:33

Hi all,

i*m just watching the TV-channel DMAX with my favourite TV-Series, Wheeler Dealers with Mike Brewer and Ant Antstead. And there they are just working on a Alfa Romeo 164. They have to repair the Power Steering and that is exactly the same as in this thread. I sah all parts mounted on the rack and motor as it is shown in the Kit. Unbelivable.

Cheers
Roger27TBB

saabfast
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Re: POWER STEERING

Postby saabfast » 25 Feb 2019 19:40

Most smaller cars now have electric power steering. S&S do a kit based, I believe, on the Corsa system. (http://ss-preparations.co.uk/). There are hundreds of thousands of cars running around with electric systems reliably. My wife has a Pug 207 with it, the assistance varies with speed being lighter at parking speeds and weighting up at speed, I think most are like this.
Alan
Saab 9-5 2.3t Vector Auto Estate Stage 1
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Hasbeen
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Re: POWER STEERING

Postby Hasbeen » 26 Feb 2019 05:58

Be careful what you do with your TR7 steering. The most dangerous thing about my Honda S2000 is the too light, too quick steering.

When I was a young bloke, racing Formula 1 & Formula 2 open wheelers, & had a steering suspension & brake shop. I did a fair bit of suspension tuning for other people. There were quite a few open wheelers with a local rack, with 1.5 turns, lock to lock. This gave go-cart like steering, something you don't want at high speed.

I did suspension set up on a number of these, & the first thing I did was throw out the rack, & fit a new rack & pinion, with 2.4 turns lock to lock. In a couple of instances this was all I did along with an alignment as the spring rates & shock settings were fine.

In each instance the driver was a couple of seconds quicker, as he could now add fine inputs to the steering, rather than the ham fisted inputs the fast rack caused.

An over fast rack is fine on really tight stuff, but has no place in a car that is going to be cornering at 80 MPH & above. In fact I believe it is the over quick steering that is responsible for most S2000s that die, do so backwards into the scenery, after an over correction of a minor slide.

I believe these over fast racks are used so modern ladies can turn right-angle turns in suburbia, one handed, while still texting with the other. :twisted:

Hasbeen

saabfast
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Re: POWER STEERING

Postby saabfast » 26 Feb 2019 12:25

Going by the ones I know, I don't think the racks are particularly fast, just have a lot of power assistance (and can be too light). Lock to lock does not feel different in the number of turns. I think most of the after market kits (like S&S) retain the original rack but change out the steering column to one with an electric motor on it.
Alan
Saab 9-5 2.3t Vector Auto Estate Stage 1
Saab 9-3 2.0 SE Turbo Convertible
'81 TR7 DHC
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busheytrader
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Re: POWER STEERING

Postby busheytrader » 26 Feb 2019 13:40

Back in the day, I had a test drive in Grinnall's V8 demonstrator. It had power steering with a quicker rack fitted.

I'd driven for 2 hours in my wedge to get to his workshops. I felt that if I'd sneezed in his car, I'd have been in the nearest ditch instantly....... it may have been different if I hadn't got straight out of mine into his.

prackers
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Re: POWER STEERING

Postby prackers » 26 Feb 2019 19:43

I use a Corsa electric unit in my Lexus V8 7 with a S&S quick rack and it has worked fine for 5 years plus now. I seriously wouldn't consider building a 7/8 without now! I already have two more units to fit the convertible's in the pipeline.
1978 TR7 FHC 4.0 Toyota V8
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Rich K
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Re: POWER STEERING

Postby Rich K » 01 Mar 2019 16:29

I, like Beans, have also been looking at the hydraulic system offered by Classic Driving Developments. It seems like a well engineered solution and has a rack with 2.84 turns lock to lock. Personally I would rather have a hydraulic power steering system than an electric one as I believe it will provide better feel.
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Stag76
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Re: POWER STEERING

Postby Stag76 » 01 Mar 2019 21:30

I used a Subaru "L" Series, 1979-1984 PAS rack, Volvo 240 Tie-rods and Ford pump on my last TR7, and it
drove well.
I'm adapting a Barina (Corsa) electric system for my current project, as the Subaru ones are extinct in
this part of the world.
The Corsa processor has 3 maps for different speed ranges, and I bought an adjuster that manually selects
different maps.

John_C
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Re: POWER STEERING

Postby John_C » 03 Mar 2019 09:50

My TR7 has light steering so there is never a thought of an electric power steering conversion. If I were disabled in some way it would perhaps be understandable but as I often say in conversations about the steering, if your TR7 has heavy steering then there is something wrong with the steering. Parking speeds might feel a little heavy to anyone used to a modern car but the needle roller bearing kit on mine even eradicates that possibility. When parking, always ensure your wheels are creeping rather than trying to turn them with the car stationary - that's the secret most have forgotten these days owing to power steering.
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Rich K
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Re: POWER STEERING

Postby Rich K » 03 Mar 2019 10:38

I agree that the original manual steering rack should be adequate where the car still runs on the original sized tyres but cars running on wider rubber require more steering effort at parking speeds. My car has 195/50/15 tyres on the front with the roller bearings on the top of the struts and is uncomfortably heavy to manouvre at parking speeds. I imagine that higher powered V8s would also benefit from an appropriately geared power system as the 3.9 turns lock to lock of the standard rack calls for a lot of arm twirling when pressing on on twisty stuff.
1980 TR7 drophead now repainted and awaiting V8 upgrade
1977 TR7 fixedhead awaiting restoration
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FI Spyder
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Re: POWER STEERING

Postby FI Spyder » 03 Mar 2019 15:05

I had the worst of all worlds with the Spider for a stock machine, 13" steering wheel of the PS TR8 and manual steering of the TR7. I changed to needle bearing setup up which ready helped but I was comparing a dried friction set up to greased bearings so not a real/fair comparison. When the leather of top half of the wheel (California sun damaged) started chunking off, I put on an identical (for all intense purposes) 14" wheel which gave me a little more mechanical advantage (what TR7 owners usually have) plus the ability to see the dash signal lights under the top of the wheel. No idea what different tire size does as it would depend on width, diameter, offset of the wheel and other changes like lowering antiroll bar how that all changes steering geometry. I grew up driving standard steering (only our new tractor had power steering) so was used to it in a sense. Still tend to only move steering wheel while moving the car, not a technique you need or learn with the ubiquitous power steering most learned to drive with.
- - -TR7 Spider - - - 1978 Spitfire- - - - 1976 Spitfire - - 1988 Tercel 4X4 - Kali on Integra - 2013 Volt - Yellow TCT

saabfast
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Re: POWER STEERING

Postby saabfast » 03 Mar 2019 22:35

I put the needle roller bearings in the strut mounts when rebuilt about 14 years ago. When I had to put new inserts in the struts about 5 years ago I found the grease in the bearings had gone hard and they hardy worked so stripped and repacked them. The steering has never been light at paring speeds although OK on the open road.
I too learnt in a time without PS and that you only turn the steering with the wheels moving. I still cringe when I see 'people' parking (avoiding any sexism) and just turning the wheel when stationary, it is no wonder the joints and suspension rubbers wear out with the forces twisting them.
Alan
Saab 9-5 2.3t Vector Auto Estate Stage 1
Saab 9-3 2.0 SE Turbo Convertible
'81 TR7 DHC
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